John Stott’s comment years ago was very appropriate when he said that the pastor’s study is replaced by the terminology “pastor’s office.” He said the study is where you learned and understood and heard from God and then went and spoke to the people. So I pursued it. She told me “That won’t sell!” and she was right. In situations like that it is much more comfortable to focus on the messenger. This, of course, is not a trivial matter. (I am told his new book comes out this month.) A low point and perhaps a high point that you would like to share with us? Abnormally born as it were, wrenched from the womb (in terms of calling), the convergence of various cultures into his life—the Greek, the Hebrew, the Roman, and now speaking to the Christian. Some day historians of 21st century American evangelism will perhaps see how important Ravi Zacharias is as an example of dishonesty in places where we might not expect it. He was 74. We are talking about leadership, and you probably have a lot of different ideas of how we could develop this, but is there anything you feel needs to be said about leadership in general? To me, accountability starts off with moral and doctrinal with your denomination. What more have you discovered since writing the book? When I think of character, I just don’t think of obedience or of simply being aligned with the claims of God upon your life. I think it is one of the greatest books ever written. I actually parted ways with my literary agent when I told her I wanted to write a book defending atheists. In that interview (which I strongly suggest you read before proceeding with this article), Mr. Baughman outlined evidence for some very concerning behavior, including claims that Mr. Zacharias has consistently fabricated details about his academic history as well as that he engaged in sexually predatory behavior. His apologetic especially given to Felix, is, I think, absolutely marvelous. If you are called to lead and you don’t lead, somebody else will. The founder of Ravi Zacharias International Ministries on his new book, ‘The Logic of God.’ Ravi Zacharias has spent the better part of his life answering questions about Christianity . What about the competence level of leadership? And without pushing it too far, the point is still well taken. The high points are wonderful, but also must be tempered with a grain of salt. I really believe that I am also accountable to my wife and children. Tag: An interview with Ravi Zacharias Ravi Zacharias has “Good News For Happy Unbelievers” [An interview from the magazine Christianity Today {date unknown} with Ravi Zacharias, who came to Christ in India during a crisis and is now an evangelist and apologist for Christianity on campuses nationwide] JC: How important do you feel character is in the realm of leadership? And, nobody was investigating it. I was uneasy too, and we made one agreement: We would not tell anybody what we were thinking. But in the last few years, I think the one who has best represented my calling is the apostle Paul. I think of it as the very motive: What it is that drives you to serve and do what it is that you are doing? In an interview on The Pastor’s Heart, Paterson observed that many Christians are responding to the Ravi Zacharias scandal by saying, “Yes, but we’re all sinners and God works through sinners.” This response, said Paterson, makes it “almost as … If someone wants to go into ministry, my suggestion is: Find someone who can keep an eye on you early so that you don’t develop bad habits that are hard to change once you get into ministry. If your heart is in the right place, your fiscal accountability should be under some one else’s scrutiny, and I keep that under my wife’s scrutiny. The team interviewed Anurag Sharma, the co-owner of the Atlanta-area day spas who said he was a longtime friend and admirer of Zacharias. Sometimes it may not always be that evident. We then we added a fourth word that could also be included, which was community. We are not flying by the seat of our pants and manufacturing our own little theology as we go. Margie and I were walking out, and there was a man standing there. This is our role, being a real servant of the King. The system seemed rotten to the core. That was just one link, but there were a series of links from John Stott directing me to the seminary to the man, Mr. D.D. A leader has to be very disciplined. He has fine tuned us that way. Writing a book like that is a thankless task. All of my evangelism, as I heard it then, was geared to the unhappy pagan, as it were. I really think that today, as Christian apologists, that the biggest challenge to the faith is not an intellectual question. That makes for laziness when we think, I got my sermon case and I got my hundred sermons in the bag, I don’t need to be studying. I love reading some of the great authors of our time. The money became the means of procuring what it is that felled them. Yes, power, but money is a big thing. When I think of my life as being so involved in words, I think of God putting in that DNA right from the beginning. I have so many questions for you. Fire begets fire. Prominent Southern Baptists gave Ravi a lifetime ministry award, and the Southern Baptist Convention had him speak to their annual convention in Dallas. Tim Tebow. Out of the fifty-two weeks of the year, there are maybe two weeks when I’m by myself writing. I believe it is important to have that. Then, accountability to my executive committee, where they talk to me and ask me the questions they want. (Last week I documented my findings. To borrow a line from David Hume, my book basically “fell stillborn from the press.” The religious press would not touch it and it garnered precisely zero reviews other than yours, (with a few mentions by relatively obscure bloggers). I am seeking Him and his wisdom in a certain matter. They are more lost in a sense, and desperately in need of finding the Savior. There are different types, of course, but the Son of Man came to seek and to serve. In its initial “interim” report RZIM leadership not only confirmed the allegations but promised a full and thorough final report. I think that comes through my mother, who was a very tenderhearted woman. Looking at Jeremiah and the demands God placed on him, with all of the questions that he had, he was always raising questions before God, Why, why, why? They are the punctuation marks in life. One of the things I’ve done is I do not take my engagements. So there have been some low points in the earlier days of ministry, some disappointments. But we are the only ones who claim a new birth. English writers have also helped me greatly. ), , Ravi describes his near brush with a Vietcong ambush in 1971. What about the person who has questions and feels no need? As much as I want to be there, I take a few for my need so I can be replenished and blessed, but my primary ministry is in adversarial settings. That was the first thing; God took me there. My answer may be very different to what others may give you. The structures in that sense are restrictions; they are not absolutes. If you do not lead, somebody else will. was released, I decided it was time to return to our conversation in order to find out how evangelicals have received Mr. Baughman’s evidence as well as whether there are any pertinent updates to his concerning case against Mr. Zacharias. My life is on the road. Are there any specific accountability structures you have in your life right now? | Courtesy of Passion Conference/Phil Sanders Two days before Christmas, Ravi Zacharias International Ministries confirmed that its founder had engaged in sexual misconduct over the course of many years. I have a traveling associate who is with me all the time. That was a big change for me, moving from the comfort zone of church evangelism, where I cut my teeth. JC: What about accountability structures? There is a fraternity that we all must have. Packer, John R.W. Do you have a metaphor or image which has guided you in your life? "It's a huge loss," she tells CBN News. If you cut off the resources, you are in one way trying to stop the cash flow. Mar 09, 2020 When was the last time you had a deep, authentic conversation with someone face to face? mountain of evidence against Ravi Zacharias, nobody should assume that I spend my whole life sitting around thinking about the man. Observing the kind of men I worked under, they left me with this impression and a desire to be like them. Bad habits are formed early. A prominent Canadian religious broadcaster wrote me and said she read the book in one sitting and that it is “teaching us a tough and needed lesson, and God’s work in our lives is better because of it.” I’m not sure what she means, though. Three minutes ago I received an email informing me that my new Celtic guitar book is nearing completion (with a reputable publisher.) I should leave it at that. The starting point of good apologetics is Trinitarian, and God Himself is a being in relationship. You have that gift within you; it is there. I do not like leaving home and yet half of my life is spent on the road. And yet, they came to know Christ. Our speakers, events, and all our content are entirely supported by donations. has been received? This appeared in numerous early newspaper announcements for his preaching events. He has spoken all over the world, and numerous universities, to heads of state, and to government officials around the globe. A calling is a beckoning. (Nobody accuses the Boston Globe’s Spotlight unit of being “obsessed” with Catholic pedophilia.) I think it is important to know that. So I know that at least some of them sell. I’m just a few months younger than he is, but Joseph has modeled a lot for me. Major John Carter: In our leadership class, Zacharias, we discussed metaphors or images which guide leaders. JC: We added a word: community. Two years ago, Steve published an exposé on Ravi, revealing a pattern of sexual misconduct and deception by the famous apologist and those around him.Yet few paid any attention. JC: That’s a wonderful answer. But before RZIM was formed, I was a professor at Nyack, the Alliance seminary, and I had just spoken for Billy Graham in Amsterdam in 1983. I have a doctrinal accountability to a denomination. They are able to deal with me if I am not towing the line. This is getting long so I will stop there. I said, “If God were to bring that in, I would build an organization to reach the thinker and train men and women to do Christian apologetics all over the globe and to do it well.” That was in August. This is ironic for the man who so often recounts his “bed-of-suicide” promise to God; “I will leave no stone unturned in my pursuit of truth.“. Today it is almost a manufactured profession. It became the school where I needed to be and with members of the faculty: Walt Kaiser, J.I. In November of that year, two months after that, I was speaking in Ohio to three hundred laymen, and after my last message I made this comment: “As you are driving back to the airport, would one of you in each car pray for God’s leading in my life? I love my anonymity. Today’s interview is with Ravi Zacharias. So the information is out there, but it seems to have no effect on business as usual. And if that is true of the common person in conversion, how much more true it must be of ones in leadership. Each new discovery of a false Ravi claim made me more convinced that this famous man was a serial deceiver. But I’m still proud of Is the Atheist My Neighbor? But the biggest challenge to the Christian faith is this: If the message that we have lays claim to a supernatural regeneration, then why is it that we do not see that regeneration more often? He said, “Can I talk to you for a minute?” I said, “Yes.” He said, “I don’t know what it is you are seeking God for, but I went back to my room and got on my knees and said, ‘God, what is it that that young couple is seeking wisdom for? There will be people who let you down, and I’m sure we let other people down. We should not underestimate the role of leadership. The competence is shown by somebody who works at what it is that he is gifted and called to do. And more. SB: It’s funny, that question (or something close to it) is probably the question I’ve been most often asked by Ravi defenders. RZ: I think to me there is a very clear relationship. To me the key is, Who knows where your checkbook is, who knows where your money goes? Number one is humility. Not many, it turns out. This appeared in numerous early newspaper announcements for his preaching events. In the organization that he works with, there will be ripple effects of failure. To begin with, can you talk about how Cover-Up in the Kingdom has been received? Has there been any time over the past in which you felt your calling has changed to some degree? I thought to myself, This is unbelievable. I miss some of that; it was wonderful. We also see it in his faculty bio at the 2012-2013 Southern Evangelical Seminary catalogue, (page 83.) HarperCollins Christian Publishing announced a new book deal for Ravi months after he paid hush money to settle his sexting lawsuit. I have a plane. The disciplines that are needed for sermon preparation and delivery will be taken for granted. Did Mr. Zacharias respond to it? He was born and grew up in India, before immigrating with his family to… You are in effect becoming a counterpoint to what it is you are propagating. What biblical leaders are most important to you, perhaps in defining your own leadership? Do you have a metaphor or image which has guided you in your life? a ‘professor at Oxford’” or “No, the suicide threat he made to cover up his online misconduct is a forgery!” Instead it has been about my motives. Ravi’s denomination, the Christian & Missionary Alliance, covered it up and issued a press release that was carefully crafted to say absolutely nothing. Ravi Zacharias: Janet, good to be with you and your gathering around your home. In hundreds of comments made to me over the past four years I can probably count on two hands the times Christians have actually wanted to engage me on the evidence. You see it happening again and again, much more than you would want to or even thought it would happen. More important, as Evangelism, Inc. ignored my findings over and over, I realized that this is about much more than Ravi Zacharias. ), In his memoirs, Walking from East to West, Ravi describes his near brush with a Vietcong ambush in 1971. Browse our entire library of RZIM podcasts, articles, and videos. But now as I look back, the Anglican prayer book is a masterpiece—the hymns, the liturgy. God says in Deuteronomy, chapter eight, I wanted you to see what was in your own heart. I’ve covered the globe for them. Daniel Sillman: Ravi Zacharias died earlier this year, but he was a Christian apologist—one of the most notable Christian apologists. Once you develop bad habits, they stalk you even after you’ve entered ministry. There was John Tiebe, who was a Canadian and was a Youth for Christ Director in Delhi under whose watch I really came to know Christ. He was 74. Not many atheists will be sufficiently motivated to pick it up because many will just say, “I told you apologists are liars for Jesus!” Meanwhile, what Christian wants to sit and read a chronicle of the sins of one of their favorite apologists? It would have been very comfortable in a self-serving way to be the lone member of this organization and carry on with all of the privacy and all of the privilege of funding, etc. Lewis. Not many atheists will be sufficiently motivated to pick it up because many will just say, “I told you apologists are liars for Jesus!” Meanwhile, what Christian wants to sit and read a chronicle of the sins of one of their favorite apologists? Here is an interesting question: Is there a relationship between your conversion and your call that is more than just incidental? An accountability on the road to where I don’t travel alone. JP: And you too. (Neither Ravi nor SES have responded to my several requests for comment. You have the calling to be an expositor of the Gospel. Nobody should care what I am doing with my life, but they can google me if they do. His brother, Ramesh, actually reported me to the Toronto Police after I asked him for comment on Ravi’s suicide story. The problem is that by the time of Ravi’s first honorary doctorate (Houghton College 1980) his father had been dead for a year. Your podcast has started playing below. We really need to have a humble heart. When I inquired of the network they said Ravi pays his bills and has not violated the broadcaster’s ethical code. I would rather step back and let somebody else do it in the forefront, so Moses became that model leader that I looked at. I remember a number of years ago being a part of a conference in Wales where the theme on Christ was “The Servant King.” If the King Himself came as a servant and to serve, then that should be the model we have for ourselves. RR: Steve, thanks for agreeing to do a “part-two” for this interview. A prominent Canadian religious broadcaster wrote me and said she read the book in one sitting and that it is “teaching us a tough and needed lesson, and God’s work in our lives is better because of it.” I’m not sure what she means, though. (Nobody accuses the Boston Globe’s Spotlight unit of being “obsessed” with Catholic pedophilia.) I almost want to nuance it with the idea of giftedness because sometimes you can teach a lot of skills on exposition but a person may not have the competence or the giftedness to do it. In various places Ravi recounts a very touching scene where his father sat in the front row with tears streaming down his face as Ravi received his first honorary doctorate. There are some times when there are low points where great disappointment comes to you, maybe in people, in relationships. He passed away very suddenly two years ago. And speaking of that alleged suicide attempt, a year or so ago I began investigating the story, which Ravi has told millions and millions of people over the decades. I remember beginning the interview by apologizing for all … Find more thoughtful content on these topics in RZIM Answers. None of that changes the importance of the story. interrupting your podcast! I talk about this to my colleagues. We also see it in his, at the 2012-2013 Southern Evangelical Seminary catalogue, (page 83.) The office is where you manage a group of people. My wife does. I think if character is not there, you are not only destroying the role that you are called to, but the message that you are carrying. Ravi Zacharias. In an exclusive interview with CBN News, White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany got emotional discussing the recent passing of famous Christian apologist Ravi Zacharias, someone who made an enormous impact on her with his Christian faith. Home of progressively evangelical, generously orthodox, rigorously analytic, revolutionary Christian thinking (that's what I'm aiming for anyway). And more. Filed Under: The Tentative Apologist Tagged With: apologetics, Ravi Zacharias, Steve Baughman, Copyright © 2021 • Randal Rauser • A Steady Site. Attacks on Christianity and the church are rampant in today’s society. A true appraisal of my own heart and every man and woman’s heart is that we need to be humble before God. 3755 Mansell Road, Alpharetta, GA 30022, USA (770) 449-6766. The interview … However, the passion and the end will not automatically come together because it takes competence to get you there. However, I’m still licensed and ordained by the Christian and Missionary Alliance. (I was able to confirm with the newspaper that their report was based directly on the written account Ravi had provided them.). So all of this, being raised in India, living in the West, connecting now between East and West, there is no doubt in my mind that my calling, my upbringing and conversion, there is a very real strand tying it all together. Unbelievers once revered the church and its teachings, but today they scorn them. SB: I have three of your books. So accountability to me is when proclivities have resources, then possibilities become actualities. And I thought, What about the happy pagan? While some of these are relatively trivial, they do reveal that Ravi Zacharias has very low regard for factual accuracy. RZ: This obviously is very important. I mean, He could have taken them six weeks across and brought them into the Promised Land, but He had them for more than forty years so they could see what was in their own heart. Writing a book like that is a thankless task. Ravi’s ministry has not responded to my inquiries. I am more and more convinced, as the seventies and eighties have brought to our attention, you cannot have lone horses out there. I think Billy Graham made a very simple statement years ago when he said it was a great day in his life when he learned that God can use good organization. Why don’t you just leave him alone?! They were priests in South India, the top rung of priests. I might also add—this is one thing that is not stressed for many who go into the ministry at this time. First, in my ancestry. First and foremost he helps people understand that everyone, even an atheist, has faith...Ravi points out that while there is a coherence to God, that there are no contradictions in Him, there is plenty of contradiction in us. That is why we turn down ninety-nine percent of our engagements. These are measures one has to take because no matter how many exterior structures there are, if you are not honest inside, you will find ways to be dishonest. Competence is a big word. Now I know that you’ve continued to research Zacharias in the last two years. Still, with the proviso that what follows below contains. Here is the last question: Is there anything we have not covered that you think may be helpful to me and my colleagues? We can talk, and then if it is still on your heart, we can move forward with that.” He said, “You’re a busy man. This, of course, is not a trivial matter. Apologist Ravi Zacharias died Tuesday, May 19th, two months after he announced he had been diagnosed with cancer. That’s not good. He knows where I am twenty-fours a day, and I don’t go out at night on the road if I am not speaking. The second thing is that my conversion was on a bed of suicide. There is something in your heart that God seals, and when I look at the way it has happened, the steps one after another, I could never have engineered any thing like this. We talk about things like my travel, my daily issues, what I’m wrestling with. He really was a ‘professor at Oxford’” or “No, the suicide threat he made to cover up his online misconduct is a forgery!” Instead it has been about my motives. But it helps to remember that you must keep your eyes focused on your calling, otherwise you will give up. Get up to speed here.. But in 1971, a few months after the event, he told his student newspaper at the Ontario Bible College that he saw “a bullet riddled car and a blood soaked body.” So the body count had quadrupled. RZ: Definitive. My wife and I shared with him the vision to reach the thinker and he had tears in his eyes. They translated the first Malayalam-English dictionary, which is one of the most difficult languages in the world. My great grandfather translated the works of Shakespeare and Arabian Nights; he was a linguist. In fact, I have not heard an intellectual question to the faith that has disturbed me. Interview with Ravi Zacharias by Richard L. Schoonover, associate editor of Enrichment journal. It is important that we understand how God has so fashioned us. : Thank you for being one of the few Christians to take the Zacharias deceptions seriously. “For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you.” Matthew 7:2 Ravi Zacharias is one of the most well-known Christian apologists and evangelists working from the United States. My great-grandfather and my grandfather were linguists. How you deal with members of the opposite sex, how you deal with fatigue, the challenges to your capacity, and the parameters of your own capabilities. Then there is leadership accountability we put into our planning at the beginning of each year. That’s one of the reasons why our organization is a team. When I was first taken in by Ravi’s powerful preaching in early 2015 I had no idea what was in store. So, as you are looking at leadership, humility and discipline are two very critical roles for young men and women as they labor to go into the ministry. Apologetics became the seasoning in the main course that I offered, which is the Gospel of Jesus Christ. The truth is that Ravi left the University after his first year. JC: You have certainly given us definition of your calling. It’s spelled front and back the same way. Zacharias, who was born in Chennai in 1946, founded his organisation, Ravi Zacharias International Ministries, in 1984. Zacharias Described His Wife as a ‘Beautiful Blend of the Irish & Scottish’ Zacharias said in a 2018 … RZ: Very important. I stay in areas where I am known by the hotel personnel, so I am accountable in that sense. (Neither Ravi nor SES have responded to my several requests for comment. I now look at my family tree and think it is remarkable. : It’s funny, that question (or something close to it) is probably the question I’ve been most often asked by Ravi defenders. I would prefer, however, that they google “Ravi Zacharias credentials and sexting lawsuit” and then start behaving as though integrity in apologetics matters. RR: I can’t say that I’m surprised. I would probably say the most powerful book I read in the eighties that changed my thinking an awful lot is G.K. Chesterton’s Orthodoxy. JC: In speaking about difficult times and perhaps adversarial areas, have there been any low points in your life that have influenced you in your ministry? It’s the Webster’s of the Malayalam language. Ms. Green says of the interview, "Listening to Ravi Zacharias will make you see a whole different way of looking at faith. You can support Steve Baughman in his work by ordering Cover-Up in the Kingdom here. There are so many things to affirm that this was of God. Now, even more irrelevant to the growing mountain of evidence against Ravi Zacharias, nobody should assume that I spend my whole life sitting around thinking about the man. and keep going that way, but I never wanted it that way. My professors were very influential in my life in the early days—people like Norm Geisler, his impact on me. People are looking for that. With a servant’s heart, people will follow a good leader, who is setting the example at the same time. , A new discovery for me is that Ravi presented himself for years as having earned a BA from the University of New Delhi. When I see a need, my heart is touched. They do in terms of their writing. Ravi Zacharias was interviewed in April 2005 by Major John Carter of The Salvation Army for a leadership class at Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary (Charlotte, NC branch). SB: Thank you for being one of the few Christians to take the Zacharias deceptions seriously. Ravi was not only a significant personal influence for me, he was a great friend of this ministry for years. During our interview at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, she became emotional when talking about the recent passing of famed Christian apologist Ravi Zacharias. The ministry Zacharias founded, Ravi Zacharias International Ministries (RZIM), issued a statement calling the accusations “false.” The ministry would not answer WORLD’s questions about the accusations but said it had commissioned an independent investigation. Ravi corrupts this important dialogue with his fake credentials and his general lack of integrity. In that interview (which I strongly suggest you read before proceeding with this article), Mr. Baughman outlined evidence for some very concerning behavior, including claims that Mr. Zacharias has consistently fabricated details about his academic history as well as that he engaged in sexually predatory behavior. 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